>jajajajajajajajja you know your economics well but you need more info on Colombian affairs.

Thank you for being nice about this. I learn as much as I can about Colombia from the available media. One of the things I have learned is that the available media don't tell me what I really want to know. Case in point: even from the limited number of times I have been able to get the links on this thread to open, it is clear that their content mutates about as quickly as the talk page for Wikipedia's 9-11 article. This is one reason I had to call Colombia to see what was being reported there. That the left would be reported as linked with US corporations rather than the right, while nonsensical, would be consistent with a scenario in which news items are being politically inverted to favor parties with more media influence (the right).

>I dont blame you most people dont know it! It was during JFK govt that general Yauborough came to Colombia and advised special extreme corps be creted in the army to supress any kind of comunist movement or genesis. thats when it all started, the killings of indigenous people in land were there is oil or farmeers and peasant with nowere to go because landowners have all the good land.

This part is clear from available media. It sucks, but it also represents a kind of activity commonly attributable to the governments of any large nations, including those nations whose influence the JFK administrations believed they had good reason to want to thwart. I might like to think I would have done things differently, but I wasn't there. I also wasn't living in Germany in the 1930's.History is important to understand, but to consider what may yet happen is more important than to consider what else might have happened.

>uribe belongs to one of this families that started this milicias to protect their selfish dominion of the land, when he was governor of Antioquia his second apointed to his staff had a company which was caught importing 25 tons of permanganato d epotasio, used in the synthesising of the coca alkaloid!

This part is less clear, although I find it totally plausible.

>(i missed the rethorical question you spoke of)

It was about comparative hypocrisy. Please feel free to forget it now.

>Do you know what the Monroe doctrin is?

The Monroe doctrine is long dead in principle. Why anyone would still be trying to use the Monroe doctrine to justify ANY decision is beyond me. That genie has been out of the bottle since at least World War One, and trying to put it back in the bottle just makes the US look like it's trying to have things both ways, which is plain silly. The US must not try to use the Monroe doctrine as some kind of magic security blanket to make itself politically and militarily invisible to other nations whenever it starts to look like the results of our meddling are not going to be what we hoped for.

>this goes well beyond fairplay in politics, this is a canstant manipulation and boycot of our development as a nation to keep us a cow for the bloodsucker, you need only take a look at the relationship and authorship of the Patriot Act and the Plan Colombia, and that is just the contemporary and upcoming result of all that has been going well before the US govt took Panama from us in the 1000 day war!

I'd actually be OK with Panama being reincorporated into Colombia. I would actually like to see this happen through diplomatic action excluding nations other than Colombia and Panama. Surely the peoples of these nations have the right to cooperate without interference from the US or other nations. Will they, though? That's not up to me. Sorry.

>I would declare a state of crisis and emergency, id sign the oil traties the US have told us not to sign with China and i would make a special cabinet that would pass out laws specially designed to bring the country to a balance all land under 70% of production has a tax of 5 million pesos for every 10,000 squared metres per month. That will force people to star giving away their land to the state or selling it very cheaply, there would be a special program and agrary reform to insert all those lands. then do what Evo Morales did: Us companies have been taking our oil and specialy our coal and gas almost for free in the last 50 year so id kick them out of the Serrejon and othe mining land or have them pay more fair %ges, and ofcourse bann any free trade treaty, we arleady had our wconomy kicked in the as in the 90´s when gaviria sold our Country for his place as OEA vicepresident. that way i dont have to see my Colombian water botteled and sold to me by some Gringo or Hooligan Company or teh plant form my amazon patented and taken as if they were property of some other ountry.

This sounds rather extreme, but it certainly occurs to me that the continued fighting in Colombia is a large part of what prevents Colombia from being able to take a more powerful position in its relationship with the U.S. If Colombians can agree how to solve more of their domestic problems (including the many, many problems that Gringos have either created or continue to exacerbate), Colombia can expect better cooperation from all of Colombia's neighbors and can then expect a better position in negotiating with larger nations; especially China (do you really want to get me started about China?). Wealthy Gringos are rightly fearful of the prospect of a balanced relationship between China and any kind of coalition of South American nations. ANY political entity (left, right or center) that finally consolidates powe in Colombia will be able to talk with China (for example) without having to ask permission first from US interests, and will be able to obtain better deals that US interests will not want China or Colombia to get from each other. For this reason, I have come to suspect that business interests in the US and elsewhere act in Colombia from a position of vested interest in prolonging conflict in Colombia, no matter what side they will have to support. (And a hint of something to this effect is suggested by your next point, thanks...)

>I would inmediately stop Glyphosate bying and use to stop poisoning my land and my people and fucking up the quality of all our products, its so fucked up that Phillip Morris (monsanto) sells us this chemicals make a ton of money i mean a ton! and the also buy our coffee, but at half the price because because of the glyphosate the quality is not so good, thesituation is so sad in Colombia that we are importing Coffee because the war that nobody knows about, or should i say masacre is so bad that almost nobody can grow anything in peace without getting killed! there are very few people that know the gravity and seriousnes of Colombas situation! (and belive me without a doubt and you can be certain by researching for less than 3 hours Alvaro Uribe is a para miltar, This is all a vendetta becasue his father was killed in front of him by the FARC, but what almost no one knoes (how strange) is that his father was wanted for extradition to the USA because he was a druglord and a Paraco (PAra, Paraco are short for Paramilitary)

I would be curious as to what other uses are stated as justifying the mass import of chemical used to refine coca. Given that terrorism on both the left and right continues to be alleged as funded by coca refinement and export, it seems like a 'no brainer' that anyone publicly denouncing terrorism should also agree publicly, in principle, to cut off any chemical shipments that are clearly intended for coca refinement. Has anyone in either the US government or Colombian government actually tried to make something like this happen?

>i cpould write stuff like this, talk on particular and general counts talk domestic and international, social and political as well as military, but im afrais i have no time now, but im glad you show interest and have an open mind on the situation!
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I have to be interested, given my engagement to a Colombian. I know a lot of Americans still wouldn't care, or would just expect their Colombian fiance to tell them anything that might be important. Sara's pretty smart, but she clearly gets different media reports, and I think the US, Colombia and the world all deserve at least some additional efforts on my part to piece together the Colombia situation in my own mind.

I know Sara hasn't liked the tone of everything on this tribe. As long as it remains her tribe, I respect her right to delete things, but I have never encouraged it. I know Sara is a good sport, though. If we can keep the tone civil and consider the issues open, she won't feel like she has to delete things. Naturally, we both have concerns about who may be reading this and what they will do with whatever information is posted here. But we all know that some things are worth doing, even if they draw both desireable and undesireable attention.